Archive Easy Mo Bee Interview – Part Three (Originally Printed In Blues & Soul 944 / May 2005 )

Here’s the third and final part of  the interview.

BEHIND THE BOARDS WITH EASY MO BEE (PART THREE)

With almost 20 years of hit-making to his name, Easy Mo Bee’s place in the Hip-Hop hall of fame is assured. Having crafted some of the most memorable beats to ever blast from speakers, the Brooklyn-born producer’s work has helped propel the likes of The Genius, Biggie Smalls and Craig Mack into the rap stratosphere. In more recent times the Easy Mo Bee sound has been introduced to a new generation of listeners thanks to collaborations with Alicia Keys and Mos Def. In this final interview instalment, the self-confessed Hip-Hop junkie remembers his first and last meetings with 2Pac, the infamous East Coast / West Coast feud, and the tragic death of Biggie Smalls. Remember, there’s no future without a past.

It was during your time working on the early Bad Boy material that the trademark Easy Mo Bee sound really started to emerge. Did your decision to develop that sound have anything to do with the fact that clearing samples had started to become such an expensive and painstaking process?

 

“Even back when I was still with RPM my manager used to tell me to start cutting the samples in my tracks. Around that time the whole sampling issue was becoming a problem. De La Soul had problems with “3 Feet High And Rising”, Biz Markie experienced the same thing with his “I Need A Haircut” album and Hammer had gone through his thing with Rick James and the “Super Freak” sample. Producers weren’t getting away with using samples as much. A lot of companies were paying attention and suing Hip-Hop artists. What made me different with tracks like Craig Mack’s “Flava In Ya Ear”, which had the signature Easy Mo Bee sound, was that I was actually playing the samples. I didn’t want to stop using samples, but I wanted to use them in such a way that people wouldn’t be able to tell where I was taking them from. The famous sound from “Flava In Ya Ear” is actually just one guitar note transposed from low to high. Then I took that idea a step further on records like Busta Rhymes’ “Everything Remains Raw”. There were no samples to clear for that track. Why? Because I took a 1.3 second sample and turned it into a whole record (laughs). I really wanted to create a brand new sound.”

The mid-’90s must have been such a good time for you because you really were dropping hot records back-to-back?

 

“That’s true, but at the same time I was also doing records that a lot of people don’t mention as often which to me were some of my best beats, like King Just’s “No Flows On The Rodeo”. Then there’s the Lost Boyz’ “Jeeps, Lex Coups, Bimaz & Benz”. Even though I did a lot of other stuff, those records are important to me as well. But in terms of creative freedom, that period was definitely the best time for that. Right now it’s the worst time because there’s not a lot of room left to experiment. A lot of stuff right now is very calculated. Hip-Hop used to be about people just going with what was in their hearts and what they were feeling inside. But now with the growth of technology every kid with a computer wants to be a producer and because Hip-Hop has become so big everyone wants to be a rapper. But not everybody is supposed to be a producer or a rapper because they’re just not good enough. But Hip-Hop also needs other things like good entertainment lawyers and good A&Rs. We need more diversity right now. I’ve been in meetings where A&Rs have said they want me to bring music to them that sounds more like The Neptunes. But wait a minute? I’m Easy Mo Bee. I gotta do me. If you want that Neptunes sound then go get The Neptunes.”

I remember when I first heard that you’d supplied beats for 2Pac’s “Me Against The World” album. That seemed like such a big jump to have gone from helping redefine East Coast rap with Biggie’s first album in 1994 to then working with one of the biggest solo West Coast artists in 1995. How did you first hook-up with ‘Pac?

 

“There was a Budweiser Superfest that happened at Madison Square Garden in 1993 and Big Daddy Kane was performing. That was the infamous onstage freestyle with Kane, Biggie, 2Pac, Big Scoob and Shyheim. Rappin’ Is Fundamental used to hang out with Kane a lot and he’d asked us to come to the show. I was right there on the stage watching everyone rhyme and this was the time when Biggie and ‘Pac were really good friends. I’d already worked with Biggie but at that point hadn’t ever met 2Pac. I was backstage walking down the corridor and saw 2Pac coming towards me. He pointed at me and was like, ‘You’re Easy Mo Bee, right? I’ve been looking for you.’ I was like, ‘Whoa! You’re from Cali, formally of Digital Underground, a huge solo artist, and I’m on your mind?’ So I was like, ‘Cool, let’s get together.’ So we did “Runnin'” with Biggie, ‘Pac, Stretch of the Live Squad and one of The Outlawz, which was intended for the Thug Life album. When Eminem remixed that track recently I guess he was trying to capitalise off the Biggie / ‘Pac thing because he left the other people off of his version. When I first heard there were problems between Biggie and 2Pac I couldn’t believe it because when we recorded that track we were all in the same studio and everything was cool. They were real close. They laughed together. They drank together. They smoked together.”

What memories do you have of the way both Biggie and 2Pac would work in the studio?

 

“Biggie would just rhyme a lot of stuff to himself but you’d never see no notepads. I was like, ‘Damn! How do you keep all that stuff in your head?’ In the beginning he did write, but as time went on he just used to be able to spit like that. I’d play a beat in the studio and it’d be the first time Big had heard it so I’d know he couldn’t have already written something for it. He’d sit there with his hands folded over that big stomach and he’d just be mumbling. He’d do that for an hour or two, then he’d go in the booth and I’d be like, ‘Oh shit! Did you see that?’ Now 2Pac, he wrote. He’d be in front of the mic reading right off the page. But it had to happen immediately after he was ready. He moved at such a pace in the studio that everybody had to keep up with him. He was an animal in the studio and recorded at such a fast rate. But I’ll tell you one thing, after I worked with 2Pac, you didn’t really see me getting too much work at Bad Boy and I’ve always wondered if that was the reason why.”

Can you remember the last time you saw 2Pac?

 

“It was after he’d got out of jail and signed with Death Row. I’ll never forget it. I was in LA and went to this club where Dr. Dre was making an appearance. I was in the parking lot and ‘Pac rolled in with the Outlawz driving a black convertible two-seater. He got out of the car and had a real stern look on his face. He was real quiet and walking towards the club. Now I hadn’t seen 2Pac in a real long time, since the “Me Against The World” album. But what happened in that parking lot showed me just how much of an effect him getting shot in New York had on him. I was like, ‘Wassup ‘Pac?’ Now usually ‘Pac would start smiling with that big grin of his and be like, ‘Wassup Mo Bee?’ etc. But this time he was just like, ‘Wassup?’ and kept walking right past me. I said, ‘We’re trying to get into this club so we might roll with you?’ But he wasn’t really saying much, just walking. So we went with him anyway, but when we got to the door of the club they let him in but left us outside (laughs). 2Pac didn’t look back or try to help get me in or nothing like that. That’s when I realised that New York shit really did something to him. You could tell that he really didn’t trust people anymore. But I didn’t even get mad. I just thought, ‘You know what? I can’t really blame him.’ In my opinion though, 2Pac was one of Hip-Hop’s last political artists.”

Considering the huge presence you had on Biggie’s “Ready To Die” a lot of people were surprised to find out that you’d only produced two tracks on “Life After Death”…

 

“The way I remember it, me and my manager had to fight to get those two songs. At first they weren’t going to include me, but my manager at the time rah-rahed a little bit, although I still had to go through so many beats before they found the two they used. “Life After Death” took on a very commercial approach. There were still raw records on there as, but overall it took a more refined direction. A lot of good records came out of it, but to me nothing could ever beat that first album.”

Were you aware of what Biggie was going to do with the beat that became “Going Back To Cali”?

 

“I didn’t get to witness Biggie recording any of his lyrics for my tracks. I tracked both of those beats in one day with just me and Deric ‘D-Dot’ Angelettie in the studio. Finally Biggie came in with Jay-Z. They were walking up and down, pacing, writing rhymes in their heads for “I Love The Dough”. Then Biggie said they were going out for a minute but they’d be back. I waited for hours but they never came back. That was actually the last time I saw Biggie. But I told D-Dot to tell Puffy to call me whenever they were doing the next session and went home. Then without my knowledge they went and got Angela Winbush for “I Love The Dough” and put a Roger Troutman-style vocoder on what became “Going Back To Cali”. I didn’t witness any of that. I was like, ‘Why’d Puff never call me to go to the session?’ But like I said, I’ve always wondered if the fact that I worked with 2Pac pissed Puffy off. I don’t know. But I never got called for no more work with Bad Boy and I offered my services to Puff on several occasions after that, but nothing.”

But to set the record straight, was there ever any disagreement between you and Biggie?

 

“Never! Biggie wanted to do more work with me but, in my opinion, it was Puffy who steered him away from that. Maybe it was because I was rising to a certain level and needed to be stomped out? That’s how I looked at it because how could you all of a sudden forget someone who helped you kick in the door when you started out?”

So what was your initial reaction when you first heard “Going Back To Cali”?

 

“It drove me crazy! (laughs) I saw someone soon after the track was recorded and they were like, ‘Yo! You heard what Biggie did to your shit?’ I was like, ‘What? What?’ (laughs) When I heard it, it made my heart beat faster and I was like, ‘Whoa!’ He wasn’t dissing Cali at all, but the fact that he even mentioned it with everything that was going on made me wonder if we were starting trouble. I hate to say it but that’s how I felt. The East Coast / West Coast feud was something I never wanted to contribute to and I couldn’t help wondering if the track might play a part in helping it escalate. I just didn’t want people to hear that record and think that Biggie was taunting anyone because he wasn’t.”

It must have been extremely difficult for you when Biggie passed away?

 

“My heart dropped! Not to sound negative about it but the way everything was going I just had a feeling that something was gonna happen. You could feel it in the air. As soon as 2Pac got shot in New York and started talking all that stuff in his interviews about Big knowing about it, I was just like ‘Man, I hope no war don’t start.’ We really didn’t need that. I didn’t get into this Hip-Hop thing for that. We were all supposed to just be making records and having fun. And that whole thing put me in a strange position because I produced for both Biggie and ‘Pac. But I really didn’t want nothing to do with that. I’m just a music producer! There’s been a gloom that’s hung over Hip-Hop ever since then that’s taken a lot out of me. Hip-Hop used to be about being creative with the music, but now it’s been narrowed down to just being about having beef and being gangsta. Anything that doesn’t fit into that seems like it’s almost not worthy of any attention. What’s wrong with being happy? Does this music have to be dark and gloomy all the time now? We have to be aware of what we’re doing and the effect it might have on the generation that’s listening to it. This music is very influential and it touches so many people. My daughter is fifteen and I talk to her about these things all the time and I make sure she understands that some of the music she’s listening to should be treated like a movie. It’s not real. Let it go in one ear and out the other. You don’t have to be influenced by it and you don’t have to live by it.”

So what does the future hold for Easy Mo Bee?

 

“I definitely want to be more in control of what I do which is why I’ve set-up my own label situation. I wanna be able to do what I wanna do and work with like-minded artists. The music is so devoid of soul nowadays and I just want to bring that feeling back. There’s so much despair and hopelessness in a lot of what we’re hearing today. We need some old-fashioned soulful Hip-Hop right now.”

Ryan Proctor